moggy lover

Joined

• started 15 topics
• posted 797 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by moggy lover

• 
  29

  Growth and Decline in churches incl. JWs

  by Dogpatch in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  yearbook of churches issues 75th editionhttp://www.wfn.org/2007/03/msg00069.html.

  from "ncc news" <[email protected]>.

  date mon, 05 mar 2007 15:00:19 -0500. .

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  Incidently, DP, can you tell us, only for statistical data, the numbers for the SDAs. The WTS often compared themselves to the SDAs and contrived to show the divine origins for their growth by comparing themselves to the SDAs

  Thanks

  Cheers
• 
  4

  Has this been confirmed?

  by sinis in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  my ex-jw brother in law told me the other day that he received a call from a brother asking him if he would like to come back to meetings.

  he told the brother not at this time.

  to make a long conversation short, the borther indicated that they have been told by hq that two watchtowers will only be printed once a month.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  Yes it has been confirmed. Starting Jan 2008, the WT will be published in two seperate editions. The Wt of the first of each month will be a "public" edition with no study articles, and the 15th of the month will see the "private" edition which will consist of the four study articles for each month. This edition, will, like the Kingdom Ministry, only be available to fully subscribed members of the WTS.

  Cheers
• 
  25

  Acts 5:42 (from house to house) OR (in private homes)

  by rassillon in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  ***i believe i have the correct scripture here but if i don't please correct me.

  i have thought a great deal on this topic since i first read it in one of ray franz books isocf.. he had a section that dealt with the greek term translated "house to house" and compared it to other scriptures which contained the same greek phrase and showed that it was likely that it should be translated "in private homes".. now i know that some will make the point that "house to house" is a valid translation and from what i know (which is very little) cannot disagree.. what i can say though is that from my knowledge about life in this period and this area of the world and from my traveling to ruins of ancient citys i would have to agree with franz that the phrase "in private homes" makes more sense because preaching from "house to house/door to door" at that time period would have been extreemely ineffective.

  preaching in a public square and then returning with interested ones to their "private homes" for further discussion would make more sense if one was to be effective.. from those with a knowledge of the time/place/culture that this scripture applies to, do you agree with me?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  It is probably wrong to ask the question: "Does the expression "Kath' Oikion" used at Acts 5:42 mean "From "house to house" " because no answer can be given to such a question. Rather I would think the proper question is: "Can it mean such"?

  The reason for this dilemma is because the phrase Kath' Oikion can actually have two meanings. And whereas in most texts the meanings can be distinguished, in a few, such as this verse, a measure of ambiguity persists. It can have an "idiomatic" or a "distributive" meaning. If in the context of Acts 5:42, the phrase under discussion has a "distributive" meaning then it may very well be translated "from house to house" as do several translations of this passage.[See NASB, NET, Barklay etc]

  If it has an idiomatic meaning, as evidenced by a majority of translations [NKJB NJB RSV NLT AMP NEB REB NAB and even one WT approved version BY] then it would mean "privately" or some variant like "at home" or "in private homes" etc. This is the majority view because the expression "Kath Oikion" is used at Acts 2:46, where the distributive sense cannot be sustained. Otherwise we would have the improbable notion that the early Christians went from house to house breaking bread. In fact it is pertinent to point out that here the NWT does translate the phrase as "in private homes" Go figure.

  The problem for us here lies with the word "Kata" which, among its various applications flowing from its basic meaning of "According to" is a distributive one. For instance take a look at Mar 6:40, where NASB has "And they laid themselves down in companies of one hundreds and fiflties" NWT is virtually the same except for the use of "groups" instead of "companies" A literal rendering of this verse would be "They laid themselves down group by group in hundreds and fifties" [ Brown/Comfort Lit version] In a case such as this, the distributive application of Kata is clear.

  So we may concede that, were we to take advantage of the relative ambiguity in this verse as the WTS does, that Acts 5:42 could be rendered "House to house" as the WTS would have us believe. However we still have to account for the context. In this verse it tells us that "They" went from house to house and were in the Temple. Has any WTS follower ever asked the simple question who the "They" are in this verse? Hmmm? Does it refer to the whole community of believers, as the WTS insists on pressuring us with?

  The context is established by reading from Vs 18, where "they" are first mentioned. It turns out that this entire chapter is speaking about the Church leadership at time, as exercised by the Apostles. They are the "they" who are spoken of. 1They were accused 2They were beaten 3They were tried by the Sanhedrin 4They were charged not to preach in the name of Jesus. 5 They refused 6 They were finally released 7They preached in the Temple and from House to house

  Now in all the cases above, according to the WTS the "They" who are mentioned, is admitted to be the Apostles, except for the one, the last, which by some strange alchemy, morphs into the whole community of believers. I will believe the WTS requirement for the entire community to be encumbent with the house to house preaching if the WTS can explain how a small group like the 12 Apostles can be transformed into a community of believers numbering at least 10 000.

  I will also believe the WTS interpretation of this text, when I see the WTS leadership, headed by Ted Jaracz out in the field service, distributing the very literature they produce. Not just once a month, not just for one hour, but every bloody day [that's what Acts 5:42 requires] slogging it out in the heat and biting cold, from dawn to dusk. If Ted and his arrogant flunkies have a "love" for jehovah that they so boastfully claim to have, then let them go first, establish the custom, then maybe, I might follow.

  It is the most outrageous filth to see these "leaders" comfortable in their luxury, with undisclosed amounts on their credit cards, winging their way around the world in arrogant splendour, making imperious statements from behind the security and anonymity of the platforms they speak from, and the literature they spew out, about how others should act, when they do nothing to alleviate the burdens they themselves impose on their followers.

  Do NOT believe, nor be afraid of, these evil and blasphemous men. Nowhere in the NT is there ever a need for every single member of the community of believers to preach from house to house or otherwise. That is not your responsibity, nor is it mine. It is the work of the Holy Spirit. For those who have neither the gift nor the temperment for it, the Holy Spirit will raise up, not just others who do have this gift and temperment, but hundreds and thousands of others. It is only when a faithless and carnal group of men, consumed by their own prominence, and unaware of the power of the Holy Spirit, that such unnessessary commands become apparent.

  Cheers
• 
  22

  Lurkers and JWs: Are you in the truth?

  by AuldSoul in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  jesus said, "i am the way, the truth, and the life.

  " he didn't say he had the way, or that he had the truth, or that he had the life.. according to the bible, jesus is the truth; if you know the truth, the truth will set you free.. jehovah's witnesses set their dogma and religion in the place of jesus.

  they refer to their dogma and religion by a role that jesus said he would personally fulfill; they call it "the truth.".

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  The thing that truly intrigued me about the way WT followers view the word "Truth" is the way the word was portrayed in one of their publications.

  Back in 1968, at the infamous assembly when the 1975 end-of-the-world-but-we're-not-saying-anything-that-cant-be-denied-later doctrine was announced, they produced the publication "The Truth That Leads to Everlasting Life" Selling a hefty 120M copies worldwide, it is still the WTS's biggest selling propaganda item of literature. Notice the word "That" It happens to be a neuter adjectival modifier for the word "Truth" so whatever else the WTS and its accolytes believe the "Truth" to be, it is to them an "It" and not a person.

  It is conventional wisdom for the R&F membership to regard the word "Truth" to refer to the entire corpus of currently accepted WT doctrine, as sanctified by its appearance in WT literature. It is because of this that the "Truth" does not always remain "true" since, to the chagrin of the WTS, practical events overtake these "Truths" and they get discarded and become "falsehood"

  The WTS, by encouraging a corporate theological amnesia on its membership, manages with a nimble dexterity that is only possible in a hermetically sealed society, to overide any qualms that the majority would have.

  Such an arifice would not have been required if the WTS had actually stuck to the thematic centrality of the Bible - Jesus Christ - who is the Truth. In this respect the book ought to have been entitled: "The Truth Who leads to Everlasting Life"

  An organisation that cannot distinguish between truth and falsehood, and which, through strident campaigning, covers up the falsities it creates, must surely have diabolical origins.

  Cheers
• 
  20

  People named Jehovah

  by I quit! in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  has anyone ever come across anyone named jehovah?

  i've known a lot of hispanics that are named jesus.

  i went to zabasearch to see what i could find and it looks like there are few people with the family name jehovah for instance i found a "henry jehovah" and a paulette jehovah".

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  Regarding our little mate Jehovah Wanyonyi: He is certainly better looking than Ted Jaracz and looks more intelligent as well.

  Maybe we should get him to write the Wt - at least then we'll be able to get something resembling intelligibility from that magazine.

  Cheers
• 
  7

  Proof in Awake that 1914 was not the monumental year they say

  by MinisterAmos in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  lots of dubz running around now giving studies with the "learner mags" that all proclaim 1914 as the year because it marks the start of great suffering like wars, disease, greed, etc.

  on an unprecedented scale.. in 1918, the spanish flu killed 2.5-5% of the world population (wikipedia).

  ww1 which ended in 1918, cost 0.75-2% of the world population.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  Mr A! I'm surprised at you!!

  Don't you know that all things are relative and symbolic and all [other] things are symbolically relative? Any given number as processed by the WTS has certain in-built variables that make it subject to dissonant pre-cognition, wherin the pre-disposed mental conceptualization of the mature follower of the Clocktower movement can make it mean whatever it is required to mean. Any given number registering in a greater degree, in this case, 33% can by the genius of realtive symbolism, [or is it symbolic relativism?] be transformed into a metaphysical quantity less than the quotient, which in this case is .075%. Numbers are provided, not to enlighten, but to obfuscate, and, must be able, through theological alchemy, to prove whatever it is expedient at any given time to prove.

  For instace, 2+2 does not necessarily always mean four. The WTS has been able to demonstrate, through the magical art of linguistic ambiguity, that symbolically it can either mean more or less than four when it is required to do so.

  To truly understand any given set of numbers found in WT literature you need first to undergo an intense form of programming, amusingly called the "Home Bible Study" using some form of programmable material, such as "What the Thingame Really Really Really Teaches, Honest. Cross our Hearts At least Until At Least Another Publication called What The Thingame Really Really Really Really Teaches [revised edition] Comes Along"

  It is only when you have truly grasped the meaning of this programming, that you will be able to see how marvelously these numbers fall into their obedient places. The greater is made to mean less than the lesser, and the lesser more than the morer. In fact, being properly programmed you will be able to prove that by the use of numbers, the world is flat today and square tomorrow. That you are neither here nor there. Not only are you Arthur and Martha, but neither as well.

  Or something like that.

  Cheers
• 
  18

  Long long loooong WT paragraphs

  by Lady Lee in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  i have edited a few books.

  i have proof-read a few books.

  i have written many articles in college and university.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  Yep. I remember those WT studies of the 50s which seemed to go on interminably. Not only were they long, but they were optuse beyond belief. Freddy Franz in his prime could marshall the English language to such syntactical levels that made his studies virtually incomprehensible. He had a genius for taking the simplest of concepts, and with the masterful use of ambiguity, make it genuinely impenetrable.

  His motto seemed to be: Why make it simple, when its so simple to make it complicated.

  Actually my sympathies went out to those poor jerks who had the unenviable task of translating his words into another language. For that alone Franz should have been indicted for crimes against humanity.

  Cheers
• 
  7

  Cheap!

  by Core88 in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  this forum is so popular that i thought i would post here and say man i would love some feedback and peoples thought on my table of who?

  topic in the other room.

  =-) corey ps.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  Oh good. You're back.

  I'm sure somebody'll see you right, mate

  Cheers
• 
  7

  Cheap!

  by Core88 in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  this forum is so popular that i thought i would post here and say man i would love some feedback and peoples thought on my table of who?

  topic in the other room.

  =-) corey ps.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  Huh?

  Hope you wern't referring to me socks. I only bought 'em twelve years ago. Well... I did'nt actually buy 'em but what the hell who's missing 'em ....right?

  Cheers
• 
  22

  Can You Identify Your EmotiCons accurately?

  by J-ex-W in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  lol .

  i was glancing through the active topics and read terry's thread this way.

  had to do a double take--especially since i have had trouble identifying my emoticons accurately!

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  moggy lover

  OK..OK.. so I'm a computer moron... what the hell are emoticons, and how do I get to love 'em?

  Cheers